Possible Change To Spawncamping Rule?

[Moosty 148]

Hey so I know that spawncamping is, and will always will be allowed. we have the rule that admins+ can break it if it goes too far, but we never really specify what too far is, so I think we should try and do that, I have two major clarifications I think we should make.

 

 

1. NO SENTRY CAMPING TELEPORTING SPAWNS (spawns you go through a teleporter to leave)

it's just impossible to break. even with uber you cant leave spawn with it as the teleport breaks the uber chain, and the half second before you can reclick is more than enough to screw you over.

 

2. IF MORE THAN THREE PEOPLE ON THE CAMPED TEAM LEAVE, BREAK THE CAMP OR AN ADMIN WILL BREAK IT FOR YOU

Not only is it not fun for half the server, it negatively affects the population, which makes randoms less likely to see the server in the list, which negatively affects pinion revenue, plus more people just leave until @Vexx @Vixen and @Kitsune are alone on clocktown because the entire blue team left.

 

 

these are common sense changes. we've already been enforcing these when possible it would just be so much better to have official clarification.

 

what do you think? @BelloWaldi @Scootaloo @Rejects @Goblins

[Reptile 149]

Just for the record, me and Kitsune hardly spawn camp anymore if ever. Kitsune hardly ever gets on and when I do I mostly just hang around and mess about or chat while goofing off. Sometimes I'll join in but I'm nowhere near as active about it anymore. Aside that, I don't really have too much else to say right now.

[Vexx 112]

There's already an unspoken rule about sentry-camping teleport spawns, it's already not allowed. As for the people leaving, that shouldn't be other peoples problem, was that persons choice to leave.

[Goblins 580]

I agree with number one.

 

Number two however I don't necessarily agree with. Staff shouldn't have to wait for people to leave. We're trying to avoid people from leaving, right? If people are spawncamping the blue team on Clocktown and you notice that no one can leave spawn for a decent amount of time, then you should step in and break the spawncamp.

 

that shouldn't be other peoples problem, was that persons choice to leave.

 

You're right, they chose to left. But I'm sure they left because the people who were spawncamping made them frustrated.

[Moosty 148]

I agree with number one.

 

Number two however I don't necessarily agree with. Staff shouldn't have to wait for people to leave. We're trying to avoid people from leaving, right? If people are spawncamping the blue team on Clocktown and you notice that no one can leave spawn for a decent amount of time, then you should step in and break the spawncamp.

 

 

 

You're right, they chose to left. But I'm sure they left because the people who were spawncamping made them frustrated.

makes sense, what do you think would be a good time, 5 minutes of nobody being able to leave?

[Goblins 580]

makes sense, what do you think would be a good time, 5 minutes of nobody being able to leave?

 

I think 5 minutes is too short of a time. I'm thinking something along 10 minutes at the most.

 

I want to hear from the other higher ups as well before any decision is made obviously.

[Scootaloo 124]

There's already an unspoken rule about sentry-camping teleport spawns, it's already not allowed.

 

TF2 General MOTD

 

It's not an "unspoken rule". It's been in the ruleset for a long time now. There's absolutely no spawncamping whatsoever on maps with teleport exits.

 

• Spawncamping is ALLOWED on our servers, with the exception of maps that have teleports out of spawn. Only an Admin+ may deem a spawncamp unbreakable and break it.
  

 

As for the other suggested new rule, sorry, but no. If people don't want to be spawncamped, they can use the !friendly plugin. That's why it's there.

Edited May 8, 2016 by Guest (see edit history)

[realBelloWaldi 1245]

I think @Goblins has everything handled here, and I agree with him.

[Kypari 579]

No.1 is a great idea.

No.2 isn't as much. I can see where you're coming from but you can't be sure if people are actually leaving because of spawncamping or if they just want to leave to do something else. Not to mention how it would be difficult to track being as the number of players on a server changes constantly.

[realBelloWaldi 1245]

I think @Goblins has everything handled here, and I agree with him.

Didn't see Scoot's post.

as for the other suggested new rule, sorry, but no. If people don't want to be spawncamped, they can use the !friendly plugin. That's why it's there.

I mean, we're not talking about one or two minutes of not being able to get out of spawn. As @Goblins has said before, they were talking about an extended time period (i.e 10 minutes or more, I'd say 15).

I doubt people would have fun running around in friendly for like 15 minutes, they'd rather change server. Therefore I'd agree with Moosty and Goblins.

Edited May 8, 2016 by Guest (see edit history)

[Goblins 580]

As for the other suggested new rule, sorry, but no. If people don't want to be spawncamped, they can use the !friendly plugin. That's why it's there

 

Exactly what @BelloWaldi said. There is no intent to get rid of spawncamping all together; just regulating it so we don't lose population at times.

[Moosty 148]

TF2 General MOTD

 

It's not an "unspoken rule". It's been in the ruleset for a long time now. There's absolutely no spawncamping whatsoever on maps with teleport exits.

 

 

 

As for the other suggested new rule, sorry, but no. If people don't want to be spawncamped, they can use the !friendly plugin. That's why it's there.

Bruh I love you but I gotta come clean. our friendly plugin sucks and people hate it. why have we had problems with people being complaining about being killed? because our friendly plugin is awful and not a solution. We don't even punish people for whining anymore because we realized a plugin that gets you stuck whenever you bump into an enemy player wearing miscs, and makes you basically invisible, is a poorly made plugin, not a solution. weve had these problems for literal years. friendly available the entire time. I LOVE YOU BUT YOU'RE CRAY IT DOESN'T WORK AS AN EFFECTIVE SOLUTION.

[Scootaloo 124]

The way I see it, if we aren't punishing the whiners, that's our staff not adequately doing their jobs.

 

People whine because they see it as an inconvenience. You want to know the true inconvenience? Maintaining a server and providing a plugin to alleviate an issue, when we can simply ignore a secondary solution altogether and not provide a plugin and just tell the whiners "Sucks to suck." But no. They get pissy any time they have to type /friendly to prevent deaths, all because it gives their player model an opaque shading.

 

Fuck that. I hate having to pander to the loudest of those bitching. I'm going to put my foot down here and now and remind ALL of the TF2 staff that it is AGAINST THE RULES for people to be complaining about dying whilst not using the friendly plugin on our server. Our staff is to use the default warn>kick>ban process if the complaints stay up. I'm not going to be the only person in this community that upholds the rule. It's there for a reason, and if players can't take the time to type in a simple command, but can take all the time in the world to bitch about dying in our servers, THAT'S the real problem here.

 

The way I see it, we shouldn't have to cater to the loudest minority. We have a well established ruleset that ALL of our patrons need to follow and ALL of our staff needs to enforce. If I had it my way, the friendly plugin would be gone completely and complaints would be met with swift action, not pandering and hand-holding. But that's just me and I'm sure there's a ton of people out there would would disagree.

 

I know the friendly command isn't the most functional plugin on our servers, but this isn't an issue with "I don't use it because it's bad." It's an issue of "I don't use it because I don't want to be inconvenienced." So enforce the rule, we'll work to fix the clipping issues, but spawncamp rules are staying how they are.

 

That all being said, I am 100% okay with our Admin+ staff taking initiative to break camps. If a camp has been going on for a long duration (I'd say 10 minutes or longer) and it's actively affecting the flow of the server, break the damn thing. This is me empowering you to do so. If anyone complains about it, I'll have your back. But we don't need to completely rework our rules on the matter. We just need to begin reinforcing the rules already set in place.

 

Fair?

Edited May 8, 2016 by Guest (see edit history)

[realBelloWaldi 1245]

That all being said, I am 100% okay with our Admin+ staff taking initiative to break camps. If a camp has been going on for a long duration (I'd say 10 minutes or longer) and it's actively affecting the flow of the server, break the darn thing. This is me empowering you to do so. If anyone complains about it, I'll have your back. But we don't need to completely rework our rules on the matter. We just need to begin reinforcing the rules already set in place.

Actually you're right. I fully agree with this. ^

[Moosty 148]

The way I see it, if we aren't punishing the whiners, that's our staff not adequately doing their jobs.

 

People whine because they see it as an inconvenience. You want to know the true inconvenience? Maintaining a server and providing a plugin to alleviate an issue, when we can simply ignore a secondary solution altogether and not provide a plugin and just tell the whiners "Sucks to suck." But no. They get pissy any time they have to type /friendly to prevent deaths, all because it gives their player model an opaque shading.

 

frick that. I hate having to pander to the loudest of those birching. I'm going to put my foot down here and now and remind ALL of the TF2 staff that it is AGAINST THE RULES for people to be complaining about dying whilst not using the friendly plugin on our server. Our staff is to use the default warn>kick>ban process if the complaints stay up. I'm not going to be the only person in this community that upholds the rule. It's there for a reason, and if players can't take the time to type in a simple command, but can take all the time in the world to birch about dying in our servers, THAT'S the real problem here.

 

The way I see it, we shouldn't have to cater to the loudest minority. We have a well established ruleset that ALL of our patrons need to follow and ALL of our staff needs to enforce. If I had it my way, the friendly plugin would be gone completely and complaints would be met with swift action, not pandering and hand-holding. But that's just me and I'm sure there's a ton of people out there would would disagree.

 

I know the friendly command isn't the most functional plugin on our servers, but this isn't an issue with "I don't use it because it's bad." It's an issue of "I don't use it because I don't want to be inconvenienced." So enforce the rule, we'll work to fix the clipping issues, but spawncamp rules are staying how they are.

 

That all being said, I am 100% okay with our Admin+ staff taking initiative to break camps. If a camp has been going on for a long duration (I'd say 10 minutes or longer) and it's actively affecting the flow of the server, break the darn thing. This is me empowering you to do so. If anyone complains about it, I'll have your back. But we don't need to completely rework our rules on the matter. We just need to begin reinforcing the rules already set in place.

 

Fair?

Well I can confirm we aren't punishing them. Whether thats not enough staff on the trade servers, or the staff on not knowing the nuances of the rules, im not sure. But either way they haven't been punishing "the whiners" in a long time if ever. My opinion is what it always was. We shouldn't punish people for not wanting to choose between not being able to leave spawn and having to use a broken plugin that will probably get them stuck anyway. If we fix /friendly then great. Otherwise we're punishing people for what are essentially 100% valid complaints and that isn't what xG should be.