Age Requirement

[Whyte 16]

Yeah but I don't speak lawyer so IDK what to put.

 

@Whyte you're a lawyer right?

 

My daddy is. And My other Daddy is. Is that close enough?

Emma say I'm a lawyer. Im here to notarize these documents

[Rhododendron 994]

My daddy is. And My other Daddy is. Is that close enough?

Emma say I'm a lawyer. Im here to notarize these documents

I shall call you Bernie.

[Snackbar 38]

hey @Rhododendron how about you know, a final ruling on this?

[NotKoala 1]

memes

[Egossi 1017]

It should be based on maturity not age. cause look at silence and how immature he is.

keep in mind that xG members usually vouch for membership applications mindlessly

most vouches are consistent of

"+1 cool guy XDDD thanks lori

a: i duno lol

m. never met him XD"

that i believe is a terrible idea

 

although a donation requirement does sound pretty appropriate imo

i already got the pricing planned out guys don't worry about it:

$25 For member application pass with 5 extra vouches necessity (where you get to make a member app even if you are below the age requirement!)

$50 For normal member application pass

$100 For 5 less vouches required than normal

$1000 For instant-membership!

$10,000 For the ownership of the clan

$100,000 For the retardship of the clan

And after you've bought everything above, you get an additional privilege to pay:

$1,000,000 For a really expensive gun to shoot yourself with

[Duke 85]

keep in mind that xG members usually vouch for membership applications mindlessly

most vouches are consistent of

"+1 cool guy XDDD thanks lori

a: i duno lol

m. never met him XD"

that i believe is a terrible idea

 

 

Thats on DM+ to deal with and punish people for, look at mine i do it cause it doesnt matter anymore i know i wont be punished and i know it'll be counted as a vouch so why not? the problem is thats how it is, if they started punishing for this shit then yea it would make a difference in how its done.

[Snackbar 38]

look at mine i do it cause it doesnt matter anymore i know i wont be punished and i know it'll be counted as a vouch so why not?

 

which is a terrible thought process for someone with a bit higher rank to have. Maybe lead by example? Dont forget you have the ability and rank to correct people yourself, to tell them where they went wrong, thats why you were promoted. At the very least you could always alert a DM+ of the instance so it can be handled rather than just adding to the cancer.

 

Want stricter guidelines? We can d0 that.

[Moosty 148]

Thats on DM+ to deal with and punish people for, look at mine i do it cause it doesnt matter anymore i know i wont be punished and i know it'll be counted as a vouch so why not? the problem is thats how it is, if they started punishing for this fudge then yea it would make a difference in how its done.

You inspired me to look through our open member subs and correct people who had vouched incorectly but there weren't any. Tf2 vouches clean as fuck be the change you want to see or some shit.

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JfEJq56IwI

[Duke 85]

You inspired me to look through our open member subs and correct people who had vouched incorectly but there weren't any. Tf2 vouches clean as frick be the change you want to see or some fudge.

 

aight then i'll start actually doing proper vouches even tho it makes no difference, since we either get shit apps or underage kids. but on the donation thing, i dont see people donating to apply. i can see people donation then apply if csgo had something to donate for *COUGH* SILENCE DO WHAT BLEED NEEDS FFS *COUGH*

[Egossi 1017]

You inspired me to look through our open member subs and correct people who had vouched incorectly but there weren't any. Tf2 vouches clean as frick be the change you want to see or some fudge.

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JfEJq56IwI

aight then i'll start actually doing proper vouches even tho it makes no difference, since we either get fudge apps or underage kids. but on the donation thing, i dont see people donating to apply. i can see people donation then apply if csgo had something to donate for *COUGH* SILENCE DO WHAT BLEED NEEDS FFS *COUGH*

which is a terrible thought process for someone with a bit higher rank to have. Maybe lead by example? Dont forget you have the ability and rank to correct people yourself, to tell them where they went wrong, thats why you were promoted. At the very least you could always alert a DM+ of the instance so it can be handled rather than just adding to the cancer.

 

Want stricter guidelines? We can d0 that.

Thats on DM+ to deal with and punish people for, look at mine i do it cause it doesnt matter anymore i know i wont be punished and i know it'll be counted as a vouch so why not? the problem is thats how it is, if they started punishing for this fudge then yea it would make a difference in how its done.

I suppose i couldn't properly get my point across,

I'm trying to say people here don't think twice, or mostly not even once before +1'ing a member submission

I myself am against the "HEY YOU DIDNT VOTE ACTIVITY MATURITY XDDD INVALID INVALID" thing because it makes absolutely no sense at all whatsoever imo.

I would be cool with the whole membership application process if there wasn't the fact that you can't get someone out of the community unless you have evidence of them taking part in illegal activities

what i'm trying to say is my concern is the fact that everybody can become a member and nobody can be (easily) removed from member, which is unfair

take Xranth for example (people in tf2 div knows and hates him)

it took about almost a year before he got banned after he INTENTIONALLY annoyed/trolled people on servers everytime he was on (he said "the fucking retards finally thought of banning me lol" or something to me on steam pm)

I'm honestly just sick of people getting in the clan because of retards who vouch for anybody without actually knowing the person and the fact that you cannot get someone out of this community simply because you want to.

For that reason my advice is loosening the member protest rules and letting people actually get someone kicked out within the terms of democracy and justice.

 

I also don't support the lowered age rule because most kids can get member and become a huge pain in the ass for a lot of people for a long time without actually being banned/kicked out

take me for example, i got in the clan saying i was 15 when i was actually 12 and obviously with the

barely-developed brain of mine i ended up getting perma banned from all xG servers, which i did regret when i grew up and made an apology thread and the pizza challenge to get unbanned

 

TL;DR: I suggest letting people make member protests for any reason and then (and only then) loosening the member app rules. Also I do believe in the fact "Age = Maturity"

Edited December 11, 2015 by Egossi (see edit history)

[SnowyMinion 297]

Based on the kids in the generation, age limit should be there. Maybe 15 and Maturity rating should still be here. I don't want a bunch of Fangonics running around ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

[Liekos 15]

I suppose i couldn't properly get my point across,

I'm trying to say people here don't think twice, or mostly not even once before +1'ing a member submission

I myself am against the "HEY YOU DIDNT VOTE ACTIVITY MATURITY XDDD INVALID INVALID" thing because it makes absolutely no sense at all whatsoever imo.

I would be cool with the whole membership application process if there wasn't the fact that you can't get someone out of the community unless you have evidence of them taking part in illegal activities

what i'm trying to say is my concern is the fact that everybody can become a member and nobody can be (easily) removed from member, which is unfair

take Xranth for example (people in tf2 div knows and hates him)

it took about almost a year before he got banned after he INTENTIONALLY annoyed/trolled people on servers everytime he was on (he said "the fricking retards finally thought of banning me lol" or something to me on steam pm)

I'm honestly just sick of people getting in the clan because of retards who vouch for anybody without actually knowing the person and the fact that you cannot get someone out of this community simply because you want to.

For that reason my advice is loosening the member protest rules and letting people actually get someone kicked out within the terms of democracy and justice.

 

I also don't support the lowered age rule because most kids can get member and become a huge pain in the butt for a lot of people for a long time without actually being banned/kicked out

take me for example, i got in the clan saying i was 15 when i was actually 12 and obviously with the

barely-developed brain of mine i ended up getting perma banned from all xG servers, which i did regret when i grew up and made an apology thread and the pizza challenge to get unbanned

 

TL;DR: I suggest letting people make member protests for any reason and then (and only then) loosening the member app rules. Also I do believe in the fact "Age = Maturity"

 

I mean we definately want to make sure the age limit stays somewhere 13+ and never go lower but lowering the age limit shouldn't make it easy. Which is why I agree that we need to take member apps more seriously, I admit sometimes I don't, and only +1 if we actually know the person. Most of the time people just plus one but don't give a decent opinion of the person. That's what membership should be based off. We want mature people, activity is nice as well, but ratings don't really show anything to other people. For all I know those ratings are from people that have seen the person once on a server.

 

For member protests we may need an easier way to remove someone. We need to also make sure that this way can't be abused. Maybe for a member to be removed you would need a statement from a CL, if it's an issue on the forums, or a DM if it's an issue on the servers. This statement being that they have witnessed the issues leading up to the protest. Otherwise we might have people trying to spread lies and take out members they don't like based on their own issues. CLs/DMs should be trustworthy sources for this...I mean, I hope they are. D: (After reading this part again I realize that this idea is absurd, but it's all I could think of at the time)

 

Or we keep member protests as is and just get the evidence needed. If they are as bad as you say they are then it shouldn't be hard. You could also just tell a DM about what you witnessed and they can keep their eyes open.

That's just my opinion.

[Egossi 1017]

Or we keep member protests as is and just get the evidence needed. If they are as bad as you say they are then it shouldn't be hard. You could also just tell a DM about what you witnessed and they can keep their eyes open.

see the thing is this is a gaming clan on the internet, so no ty i'm not gonna spend my time on gathering evidence on what some stupid prick on the internet said to me just so i can get him kicked out of the clan/banned, just to get another stupid prick in the clan one week later, annoying the shit outta me

 

and yeah i could tell DMs to keep their eyes open, but the possibilities are any DM i speak to will act like he gives a shit and forget anything happened 2 hours later

am i blaming the DMs?

No, they're literally doing a job without getting paid or given any kind of reward, at all.

 

you can go through looking at the past member protests, you will find out barely any member protest ever got accepted, CLs/DLs/DMs go asking "WHERE IS YOUR EVIDENCE? SPEND HOURS AND DAYS TRYING TO CATCH THAT 5 MINUTES RECORDING WHERE HE GOT ON THE SERVER AND CALLED YOU A FUCKING FAGGOT AND TOLD YOU TO KILL YOURSELF, OTHERWISE THIS WE ARE GONNA IGNORE AND NEVER GONNA LOOK BACK ON EVEN THOUGH HALF OF THE CLAN WANTS HIM/HER OUT."

(^that was just an example don't go "hey who say that give name!11 D:<"

 

I think we should have enough freedom to be given the privilege of JUST WANTING THE PERSON OUT FOR NO EXACT REASON. Sure, I'm not trying to say we should allow "hey guys lets kick this guy out for de lulz Xd" but if multiple people don't want a member in this clan for a crystal-clear reason, i think we should have the right to basically votekick him out of the clan

Look at matsi's member protest, higher ups basically went "We don't give 2 shits about your opinions, we will do as we see fit" and absolutely nothing happened to matsi

a few days ago i went on jailbreak and as always matsi just tells me to stop using the word kill.. i think? im not sure he literally tells me to stop for any of my actions and i can see he is just desperately searching for a reason to get me banned/warned/humiliated..? idfk

why, you ask? I can easily bet I have less of a clue than you do

he genuinely pisses me off with his sassy behavior and the way he just acts mature and serious every time when he is arguably one of the most immature members i know in this clan

and the fact that we don't have a say in anything as members is just pissing me off even more

TL;DR for the last part: i think members should be given more privilege and the membership as a whole should be more special

Edited December 11, 2015 by Guest (see edit history)

[Forest 309]

.. It's only easy to obtain "membership" because Division Managers aren't putting their foot down on what is considered a valid vouch as opposed to a "this is the first thing I could come up with to support my +1 even though it has no specific relevance to this particular person and is a very general statement." If you want change, it begins with the Higher-Ups imposing a stricter policy on Member Submissions, as it already should be.

 

Take a look at our Membership Submission Guidelines and you'll notice a handful of things that go unheeded. However, I don't want to put the blame solely on Higher-Ups simply because Members have to do their part in compiling a meaningful vouch that actually pertains to each individual in some way. At this point, it feels like those accepting new applicants are just skimming through and counting the +1s that a particular applicant has before slapping on the "Congratulations, you were able to get into our exclusive clan". Mind you this only applies to those select few and is merely an opinion with no evidence or the like. In the end, the Division Managers/Leaders are the ones who decide who gets in for their respective Divisions. If you have beef with people who are getting into the clan that are immature, then confront your respective Manager/Leader and give them the business. Hell, you have Member Submissions to pull valid evidence from for vouches that were invalid if you need "proof" that they shouldn't even be a Member.

 

It can be just as difficult to get membership as it can be to face (legitimate) expulsion from the clan. Honestly, if you have to go out of your way to actively seek out proof or evidence against someone every day and can't find any, then chances are that this is actually some personal vendetta you have against that individual. If the offending person is as toxic or as obnoxious as someone claims them to be, then it should be an easy task to get evidence. Kicking someone from the clan for no reason other than "we don't like him/her" is by no means a legitimate reason or justified solution and shouldn't even be considered.

 

Look at matsi's member protest, higher ups basically went "We don't give 2 fudges about your opinions, we will do as we see fit" and absolutely nothing happened to matsi

a few days ago i went on jailbreak and as always matsi just tells me to stop using the word kill.. i think? im not sure he literally tells me to stop for any of my actions and i can see he is just desperately searching for a reason to get me banned/warned/humiliated..? idfk

why, you ask? I can easily bet I have less of a clue than you do

he genuinely pisses me off with his sassy behavior and the way he just acts mature and serious every time when he is arguably one of the most immature members i know in this clan

and the fact that we don't have a say in anything as members is just pissing me off even more

 

This is a prime example of someone hung up on their personal vendetta against someone. If you (in general) were to look back at Matsi's protest thread and were to wade through all of the hate and anger, you'll find very valid points that were made to support him. That thread was the first major thread to address his behaviour, and as such the only logical solution would be to issue a publicly stated warning, a cease and desist notice for a lack of better words. Anything further would just be unfair and not justified in the least.

 

Those of you who keep shouting "we aren't being listened to" don't seem to get it; you're blinded by your own values and desires. You're looking through an opaque glass that focuses solely on results as opposed to listening to rationality. Your opinions didn't go unheeded, but just because there is a large group of people against someone, that doesn't mean their condemnations outweigh the right thing to do. Obviously your sheer outrage has been noticed and has resulted in a strike against Matsi's standing, meaning that the next time he is out of turn he will receive a punishment. Isn't that progress? Does that not mean that you were heard? No, instead, in your eyes it just means that because he wasn't out right banned or faced expulsion from the clan, the Higher-Ups didn't listen to you and therefore you aren't entitled to an opinion. Not everything you say or do will result in immediate action, and this applies everywhere. This is why we [should] have level-headed Higher-Ups who try their best to appeal to both sides of an argument. They consider both sides of the argument and determine the best outcome that is fair and just.

 

It isn't easy being someone with that kind of power and responsibility, seriously. As a retired Co-Leader I can attest to that.

 

EDIT: For the sake of salvaging what's left of this thread, it isn't my intention to open up a can of worms. If you want to directly reply to this post, just shoot me a PM or something and I'll be glad to discuss it. Hell, even open up a new thread and discuss it there, that would be fine. I just implore you to not do it here so that this whole "Age Requirement" thing can be discussed properly :coffee:

Edited December 11, 2015 by Forest (see edit history)

[Vector 138]

you guys have a rule in the MOTD on tf2 trade servers that says respect little kids, but you contradict yourselves saying no immature voices but are now contradicting yourselves again by saying you should give "dah little kids a chance" when they aren't given a chance to prove their maturity. I personally don't care either way but there are some cool squeakers that wanted to get into xg but are too young to get in.

As a retired Co-Leader

dude fuck off. you're a co-leader. fucking deal with it.

a few days ago i went on jailbreak and as always matsi just tells me to stop using the word kill.. i think? im not sure he literally tells me to stop for any of my actions and i can see he is just desperately searching for a reason to get me banned/warned/humiliated..? idfk

yo make demos or screenshot shit whenever he gets on at the same time as you. if he targets you so often that should be ezpz

Edited December 11, 2015 by Guest (see edit history)