realBelloWaldi

bye BITHC > : DDDDD

shouldnt have edited that, how it looked before made it much better!

can i revert pls

Uh, can you please give us your steam ID so we can look up who banned you and why?

Xeno Gamers

You were banned for one hour. Your ban has already expired, however, I am going to leave this open and tag @Caleb956 to find out whether he actually warned you or not.

Soooooo, I am having finals next week, so I won't be around much and I cannot attend today's jailbreak event @bagel.

Furthermore, I'll be on vacation from Christmas to like January the 10th.

@virr @Egossi

Okay so right now there are four subjects that I want to touch:

1. The spray rule

2. Common Sense

3. Ban lengths/the whole protocol

4. A decay rule

1) I am not sure if we want to do some changes but I am going to be happy to hear what others think. Just read my previous post if you are curious about my opinion on the matter.

2) As I've stated earlier today, I believe we should implement something a bit more elaborate about common sense and how you should use it/what we mean by it. I want to give it an own section in the admin handbook to make it less confusing. I will touch the subject in the next section as well.

3) Apparently some people use "common sense" as a reason to ban people for the same time over and over. For example when someone is spawnkilling on surf, instead of going from an hour to a day, they keep just giving hour bans and justify it with statements like these: "still makes no sense, if you get a ticket for parking in the wrong spot three times they don't send you to prison, they just fucking give you another ticket because sending people to prison for parking violations is ridiculous". While I do not want to disrespect the person who said that and I'm gonna withhold their name, this is just not right.

Apparently the admin book does not elaborate much on determining how long you should ban someone for and I wanna just explain it a little and maybe give it it's own section too. I thought of something like this:

"Ban lengths add up by time. That means, if someone was given a day ban for spawnkilling, his next ban for the same type of rule violation will be a week ban. If he still continues to break the same rule, it will be a month ban.

Typically you are expected to ban someone for either an hour or a day on their first offense (after you have warned and kicked them). If they keep going after the first ban for example a day ban, you should make it a week. If they keep going after a week ban, make it a month ban. If someone has not changed after a month ban, you can permanently ban them.

When banning someone, there are multiple factors you should consider:

a) Has this person banned before? You can easily check that by typing /listbans [name]. If someone has been banned for a day for an offense, and then do the same thing the next day you can jump to the next ban length.

b) What has he been banned for before? Was his earlier ban for the same or something similar? You can only jump to the next offense if the offender's previous offense was similar or the same. For example, don't give someone who freekilled someone a week ban because he was spamming chat a few days before.

c) Does the person even show genuine interest to keep playing on our servers? Breaking rules happens, whether it be accidental or not. Sometimes people get heated and have to be banned to calm down, but can be a good person that generally like the servers. But that does not have to be the case all the times. If someone is breaking several different rules to avoid a longer ban (such as micspamming, then spawnkilling [on surf] and then random trading) it becomes trolling. Side note: @virr I actually see what you mean now. If someone is doing that to merely annoy others on the servers, it can be counted as one offense: trolling. For trolling the standard protocol of a day ban, then a week ban, then a month ban and then a permanent ban applies. [POSSIBLY:] This is where common sense should come into play. You have to determine yourself what type of person it is. We are asking you to remain as unbiased as possible and if you don't think you can do that in certain situations (which is completely fine), just ask a different staff member for their opinion.

Note: I don't wanna implement quote on quote what I said, but I'd like to hear your thoughts on this and implement something we can all agree on.

4) As far as I know we have not decided on anything yet. There were some suggestions for the amount of time but nothing we have agreed on yet. I stand by making it a year, but wouldn't mind that much if you lowered it to like 9 months. A year seems, however, to me as the most suitable option. Let's just decide on something!

@Vexx @virr @mrnutty12 @Elcark and maybe even @Aegean

Good post. Apparently there is some confusion about ban lenghts and the factor "common sense".

I will, with the help of the other higher ups, be looking forward to implement a "ban lenghts and common sense" section into the admin handbook to elaborate on both topics a bit more in the upcoming days.

For everyone who is asking about some kind of decay rule - we are talking about it.

Some things seem obvious to others, whereas they are confusing to certain individuals and that is fine, but it's hard to set up a "system" that covers everything since not everything is just "black and white".

@Bello @mrnutty12 @Elcark need your opinions/verdicts.

The whole situation is a bit confusing to me. This all happened like 9 months ago and I'm really not sure.

I guess I can see why someone would wanna unban him, but I'm not really sure if that's fair compared to others who have been permed due to their excessive ban history.

At the end of the day I suppose I have no real opinion on this and it's up to the rest.

Another thing I'd like to bring up. Upon further reading of the ToS for NFO, I noticed that sexually explicit material was only covered in webhosting and not game servers. I contacted their support for more clarification:

[ATTACH=full]32785[/ATTACH]

As it turns out, our current spray rules are really not even needed as strict as they are. I'd like to propose we change them to be a lot more lenient, such as no illegal content or something along those lines. What do you guys think?

@Bello @mrnutty12 @Elcark

Wow, NFO back at it again with great support. However, I would still not want pornographic sprays to be allowed, simply because children are playing on our servers and I think it's just really dumb, but I guess that's more of a personal thing. I always wonder why anybody would even want to spray porn.

I think all sprays are fine if they

a) have no illegal content

b) don't show explicit genitalia

c) show no overly disgusting things (gore and whatever)

I think at that point it becomes subjective to staff

Yeah. If you ask me that is fine since it does not show nipples or genitals.

I would personally set it to at least a year.

Well, I guess we don't have to keep arguing about Zack and Sylux since all threads are closed by now anyways.

What we should focus on now is preventing such cases in the future. Kypari and others have asked to make a clear decay rule about bans.

Do you guys think we need that? If so, how long should it be? If not, why not?

Whatever you feel like is fine. I think it's pretty strict and we shouldn't need one, but apparently we do. @Vexx @mrnutty12 @Elcark @virr

I still fail to understand why you decided to punish them both differently, "past issues" or not. They were both guilty of what they did and they both should've been punished the same.

What are you even trying to say? If we're gonna be fair here, Sylux sort of deserved a week ban. A month is way too much. Sylux has over 9 bans in his ban history and I think it is - though I don't agree with it - very obvious why Elcark chose to ban him for a month. Imagine if Sylux actually got the week ban he deserved. Would Zack - who has never been banned - deserve a week ban too? I don't think so because he does not have any past bans.

If we're going to go by Sourcebans, which I would assume you guys have been correctly punishing the two players through correctly.

Stop being so condescending. What are you trying to prove? Check the people's ban histories and you'll know that Zack has never been banned whereas Sylux has 9 bans.

isn't that odd

Why are you being so rude? Please get off your high horse and stop being so unnecessarily rude to people, specifically when it's just us higher ups talking. I had several people messaging me how you guys (i.e. thunderlimes, sesh and all the rest) hated Zack and would therefore side with Sylux. You are proving their point perfectly fine.

Unfortunately, your application has been denied!

Note: You made a new one and this one is kinda old. Let's just use the new one with the most up to date input from everyone.

~closed

you could always just set the ban to expire on monday, making the total ban a week long.

Yes but like if people feel like a week is too much we can also set it to expire after 5 or 6 days, thats what i meant

I maintain my position on reducing it to a week, but if you really want to unban Sylux right now, that's fine too.

After rethinking the whole situation, I think I agree with this the most. However, what bothers me a bit is the fact that Sylux was never kicked. Additionally, we don't really HAVE TO make it a week. We can also make it like 5 or 6 days if you guys think thats more suitable.

Furthermore, I'm not sure if punishing Zac now really helps anyone, as this all happened like 5 days ago. Would it really be efficent to ban him for something he did 5 days (or even a week when we have a final decision) ago?

@Elcark @mrnutty12 @Vexx

About the Sylux thread. What do you think?

I think it's been about three days now. In my opinion that's fair enough and I'm down to unban him. The punishment he received was excessive and he wasn't even really warned/kicked as it seems.

I'm honestly opposed to this. I think he is incredible toxic and immature for his age. The fact that all of these people come back after they talked about xG like this place was a website in north korea is a bit outrageous.

This is just my own opinion though and I don't think I can remain unbiased here. You shouldn't keep him banned because I personally dislike him.

So, consider my "vouch" on this "neutral", due to the fact that want to be fair to everyone.

On an unrelated note, I think one of the main reasons other people aren't protesting against Sylux's ban is because he isn't part of any real "in" group. He doesn't have 9 to 13 people in a discord to back him up regardless of what happens, and I do think that people who don't like him (rightly or wrongly) are going to try and use it against him.

Well said. My thoughts, quick and compressed: Was the ban justified?

Not really. Where do I start? If I recall correctly, we do a day -> a week -> a month. Were these steps followed? I don't think so. All bans that I am seeing are from about about a year ago (let's not take the ones for calladmin abuse into consideration, as that's a whole different topic). So we have one ban from 10-30-15 for disrespect. There is also the one from early this year which seems to be due to disrespect and calladmin abuse as well, though I don't know what exactly got him banned at the end. Only @Shadower may now. While I would rather give Sylux the benefit of the doubt, let's just assume it was for the same exact reason as yesterday - unless you want to take REALLY old bans into consideration, then there is no way a one month ban would be justified, as there was no recent week ban.

If you want to justify a month ban, then in my personal opinion using a week ban from 08-21-15 is a little weak, as people change during two whole years. If you think that he should have gotten a week earlier, that is fine but matter of fact, he hasn't and Sylux himself definitely cannot be held accountable for that. I'm also curious as to why Zac "only" got muted while Sylux was banned. Zac does not seem to be banned, however. Why is Sylux getting a ban and Zac just an extended mute? As far as I can tell, both are a part of the problem.

Is Sylux in the right here?

Definitely not. The fact that he made binds to specifically annoy that Zac guy is wrong and should not be condoned either. Comments like "zack if you pay me 20 keys i can teach you basic death match" are not helping Sylux's case either. I agree that Zac is definitely not in the right either, but it's just unnecessary on both sides. Someone should have tried to defuse the situation.

What should be done?

First things first I want to make it very clear that I am not speaking on behalf of anyone else. This is my own opinion and you can disagree with me all you want, but don't blame it on others if you do.

I think Sylux's ban should be reduced. I am curently not sure whether we should make it a day (or just unban him by the time this thread is closed) or a week. Looking at his past history, I can understand how some people want a longer ban, but I am not sure if a ban from 11 months ago that was not merely for disrespect is much of a reason to make it a week. This is something that higher ups need to discuss privately before coming to a conclusion.

However, a month is in my opinion too long. Zac on the other hand should either receive a day ban or a very clear warning.

And I want to shoutout @ThunderLimes for making quite useful posts. Good job (y).

Hello everyone, it's me!

Recently, someone had the idea of hosting a community night once a week where we would play a bit of jailbreak.

I don't think it's a secret that the Jailbreak server is beyond dead at this point, but I am sure there are still some people who would be down to join.

While the Jailbreak server has introduced me to XenoGamers back in 2013 and I personally really enjoy the gamemode, I'm not sure how many of you guys are familiar with it and would be willing to join.

If we're going to have these kinds of community events for Team Fortress 2 as well, we'd need to find a good time where most of the people are available. This event is probably going to happen on Fridays or Saturdays. So please comment down below if you're interested. If you are interested, it would be very helpful to me to be told at what time you are available, which would help to determine when exactly this is going to happen.

Love, Bello!

Tags: @mrnutty12 @axtinpyrothe2nd @Egossi @Goblins @Elcark @Hibiki @Tatost @bagel @Thunder @Frusty @Kypari @Tekage

Be sure to tag more people that would be interested!

[uSERGROUP=23]@Community Manager[/uSERGROUP] [uSERGROUP=34]@Co-Leader[/uSERGROUP]

I think the situation is pretty clear, can conclude this thread and come to a result?

@Septik this is all i could find from the chatlogs virr provided (then again, i just CTRL + F'd and looked for "demo")

17:43 - xG:CM virr: record a demo

17:43 - ☁NiGHTS☁: No, do your fucking job.

and him saying how he cant record mics

Yeah, i deeply apologize for my rude behavior. I was on my limit of still getting picked on and nobody would've listined, even staff members know about this issue and they deny it. But, i am fine with getting kicked off Xeno since i quited Tf2 in a whole, and found peace at single player games and will no longer bother people on Xeno and such. Again, i just cannot take it that people lie and won't listen to me.

Most things have already been said, but to get a better understanding of how giving out punishments in most first world countries works, I recommend reading this:

Presumption of innocence - Wikipedia

You have been declined from becoming a member, but you may reapply in a month!

Note:

I am sorry, but unfortunately for you, multiclanning is still not allowed, as it says here:

In order to become a member of xG, the applicant must meet the following requirements:

 

You must be at least 13 years old.

Not already a member of a different clan.

 

@mrnutty12 if you would like to elaborate on this, just respond to this thread.

~Closed

Jesus Christ.

The offender appears to be a very irrational person and should not be given any compensation at all.

Additionally, despite claiming people were racist towards him, he constantly insulted white people, which makes him racist. He even added “No white people, unless you are verry respective and not racist towards other races“ to his profile. Just imagine if any of our staff members asked specifically black people not to add them - the outrage would be huge and they’d get demoted eventually.

Furthermore, I have to add that I haven’t seen him on the servers and I’m merely basing this of the substantiated evidence.

+1

You live in the Pacific Ocean, Atlantic Ocean, Atlantic Ocean again, The southern Ocean, the Indian Ocean, The Pacific Ocean, the Copyright @ but a c inside Ontheworldmap.com, the Arctic Ocean, and GERMANY? wow

Yeah - thank you for asking actually! :)

I just recently got into sailing. These oceans dude, they're the best! But to be fair I only sometimes live there, as sailing is very time consuming and I still have to attend school :/. Still thought it would be relevant.

Other than that, I live in Germany - correct!

And yep! I drew that map myself. It took me like 3 minutes. Coded a neat little website and thought that could help some people to understand where and how I live!